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 Post subject: Rumpless gene
PostPosted: Wed Jun 14, 2017 1:33 pm 
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Old Mother Goose
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I have a blue Barnevelder cockerel and possibly a pullet who are rumpless (no popes nose) Can any one use them for a project before they go to the 'Big Farm in the Sky'?


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 Post subject: Re: Rumpless gene
PostPosted: Wed Jun 14, 2017 2:18 pm 
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Junior Champion Bird
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Personally I don't think it's a great idea intentionally breeding on with birds that have this mutation.

Aside from the issues with mating and fertility, birds need their oil gland, which rumpless birds do not have. I think it's unfair to the birds to intentionally keep trying producing this mutation (rather than it occurring accidentally/spontaneously), based purely on our own superficial desire for a certain appearance, rather than what is best for the animal.

I think it is best to send them to the farm, if keeping them as non-breeders isn't an option.


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 Post subject: Re: Rumpless gene
PostPosted: Sun Jun 18, 2017 4:52 pm 
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Fiesty Fowl
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Sue55 you have some Araucana I'm sure. Why not bring this fellow into your Ara planning, might produce something like the rumpless that the 'real Araucanas' in their home country were known for.

Azira the Araucana were an 'ancient breed' so must have coped well with the condition long before they left South American shores.

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 Post subject: Re: Rumpless gene
PostPosted: Sun Jun 18, 2017 8:05 pm 
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Junior Champion Bird
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PossumCorner wrote:
Azira the Araucana were an 'ancient breed' so must have coped well with the condition long before they left South American shores.

They were a cross breed even though they have been around for a long time (in Chile). Rumplessness does cause issues, as mentioned above. Coping, and the ability to live, reproduce and function normally aren't the same thing. Obviously it is not a lethal gene so these birds still exist. But why create an animal that can't function as fully as it should, because of something we want to look at?


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 Post subject: Re: Rumpless gene
PostPosted: Sun Jun 18, 2017 8:41 pm 
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Fiesty Fowl
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Fair enough.

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 Post subject: Re: Rumpless gene
PostPosted: Sun Jun 18, 2017 8:51 pm 
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Old Mother Goose
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I have also had it pop up in an Araucana male. So far, both he and the 2 Barnies (all almost 12 months old) appear healthy and well groomed. A bit of research indicates a couple of 'rumpless genes' - maybe not necessarily associated with lack of preen gland. Probably should have a look.
Rumpless Araucana are listed in APS2 but I don't want to go there.
In America the Standards of Perfection demand rumplessness in the Araucana (as opposed to the Americana which is comparable to the Aust. Araucana)

Couple of interesting links
http://www.araucana.net/shows-and-showi ... uidelines/
http://www.araucana.net/introaraucana/


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 Post subject: Re: Rumpless gene
PostPosted: Sun Jun 18, 2017 10:17 pm 
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Proud Rooster
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Azira wrote:
PossumCorner wrote:
Azira the Araucana were an 'ancient breed' so must have coped well with the condition long before they left South American shores.

They were a cross breed even though they have been around for a long time (in Chile). Rumplessness does cause issues, as mentioned above. Coping, and the ability to live, reproduce and function normally aren't the same thing. Obviously it is not a lethal gene so these birds still exist. But why create an animal that can't function as fully as it should, because of something we want to look at?



Why not? its done on a daily basis for the show pen with most other birds/animals...........
You only have to look back through history to see the difference in so many birds/animals that were bred for a purpose/function that can no longer perform those functions due to someones desire to change it for the show pen.........
I don't agree with it, just stating a fact........


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 Post subject: Re: Rumpless gene
PostPosted: Sun Jun 18, 2017 11:14 pm 
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Junior Champion Bird
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Ricky Bobby wrote:
Why not? its done on a daily basis for the show pen with most other birds/animals...........
You only have to look back through history to see the difference in so many birds/animals that were bred for a purpose/function that can no longer perform those functions due to someones desire to change it for the show pen.........
I don't agree with it, just stating a fact........

Why not? Because it's unfair to expect animals to live a sup-par existence for our own superficial desires.

Look at what we have done to some breeds of chickens, that are getting to the point they cannot move normally and reproduce naturally.

And to expand it further, look at what we have done to cats and dogs (among many others). Animals with faces so deformed they cannot perform basic life functions such as breathing and cleaning themselves. Bodies so deformed they cannot move, mate and birth naturally. Animals whose very existence is pain, suffering, disease and early death.

WHY should we do that? Why do we have to put our own selfish desires about what we think an animal should look like, before the welfare and well being of said animal?

(I know you said you don't agree with it, so this rant isn't directed at you, I'm just impotently shouting it to the world in general, lol).


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 Post subject: Re: Rumpless gene
PostPosted: Tue Jun 20, 2017 7:47 pm 
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Proud Rooster
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Azira wrote:
Ricky Bobby wrote:
Why not? its done on a daily basis for the show pen with most other birds/animals...........
You only have to look back through history to see the difference in so many birds/animals that were bred for a purpose/function that can no longer perform those functions due to someones desire to change it for the show pen.........
I don't agree with it, just stating a fact........

Why not? Because it's unfair to expect animals to live a sup-par existence for our own superficial desires.

Look at what we have done to some breeds of chickens, that are getting to the point they cannot move normally and reproduce naturally.

And to expand it further, look at what we have done to cats and dogs (among many others). Animals with faces so deformed they cannot perform basic life functions such as breathing and cleaning themselves. Bodies so deformed they cannot move, mate and birth naturally. Animals whose very existence is pain, suffering, disease and early death.

WHY should we do that? Why do we have to put our own selfish desires about what we think an animal should look like, before the welfare and well being of said animal?

(I know you said you don't agree with it, so this rant isn't directed at you, I'm just impotently shouting it to the world in general, lol).



LOL......re read my post. I was taking the sarcastic approuch when i said "why not"....................


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 Post subject: Re: Rumpless gene
PostPosted: Tue Jun 20, 2017 7:57 pm 
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Junior Champion Bird
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Ricky Bobby wrote:
LOL......re read my post. I was taking the sarcastic approuch when i said "why not"....................

Lol, I figured that, I just took the opportunity to rant at the world about it (hence the last line, lol). ;) :biggrin:


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