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PostPosted: Wed Apr 02, 2014 11:51 am 
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Showy Hen
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Hi all, I have recently bought some fertile cinnamon and silver eggs, and while they are 'cooking' I have been trying to find out more about them. Unfortunately, there doesn't seem to be much info out there, and what little info is available is often contradictory. Can anyone help with these questions?

1) The seller said that the cinnamons are a mix of red and dark eyed. Is this true also with the silvers, or are they just red eyed? If silvers come in both, how do you differentiate from lavender?
2) silvers and cinnamons often seem to be sold together. Are they genetically similar? Is it anything like the black and lavender araucanas that I have?
3) the big one! How do the genetics work? Are these two colours a result of 2x recessive genes? So if I breed cinnamon to cinnamon I should always get cinnamon, but if I bred cinnamon to pearl, they would look pearl but be split to cinnamon? Is silver the same?
4) have read that the red eyes are perhaps weaker than dark eyes. Do they need special sun protection or any other special treatment?

I'm sure I have loads more questions, but that's a good start! Thanks so much again guys for all your help, I really appreciate it! :th


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PostPosted: Wed Apr 02, 2014 12:05 pm 
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Wise Wyandotte
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As I understand it, red-eyed cinnamon is an autosomal recessive. So in its homozygous state (two copies) you get a cinnamon bird with ruby eyes.

Lavender is also an autosomal recessive, so in two doses you get that lighter grey colour that is proerly called Lavender.

Silver has both traits together - that is two copies of Lavender and two copies of Cinnamon & would be ruby eyed.

Now the dark-eyes cinnamons are a bit of a mystery to me, are they what is sometimes called 'mocha'? What is the inheritance of this colour? Hopefully someone will know.


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PostPosted: Wed Apr 02, 2014 2:16 pm 
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Golden Swan
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Hi Pazwegian,

No help from me, but I thought you might be interested in these links! How exciting to be hatching cinnamons and silvers! We will NEED photos when they hatch!

Guinea colour Chart
Colour Chart
Guinea Genetics

NEllyG

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PostPosted: Wed Apr 02, 2014 3:03 pm 
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Showy Hen
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Thanks Andrew! And never fear Nelly, you will be inundated with pictures :)


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PostPosted: Wed Apr 02, 2014 3:04 pm 
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Wise One
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There is reportedly a normal eyed (not red/ruby) version of brown guinea fowl here in Australia. It is as far as I am aware distinct from the red-eyed brown (so called cinnamon). Silver guineas in Australia only come red-eyed as far as I am aware.

The normal eyed Lavender can be a little difficult to tell from silvers under certain light for example, but most times silver are quite clearly considerably lighter in plumage colour than the lavenders. Silvers aren't really lavender coloured (to me), rather more of a light silver-grey. What can be used to distinguish clearly between the two, even under poor light or photographs is that lavender have dark skin, particularly visible on the neck/head, whereas silver do not.

The red-eyed birds do have poor vision. They lack the protective pigment in the eyes that serve in part to reflect some of the bright light. At least some shading for them makes sense. Poor vision possibly also related to eye structural anomalies? They are prone to running into things, & predation. They generally have some problems with roosting & feeding (poor vision). Once used to free-ranging, particularly in company of normal sighted birds, some red-eyed birds get around ok.

I view the genetics as Andrewschooks has described.

If you haven't seen the following linked site you may find something helpful in it. There is quite a bit of information here (BYP) also. http://australianguineas.wordpress.com/


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PostPosted: Wed Apr 02, 2014 7:08 pm 
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Golden Swan
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Pazzwegian wrote:
And never fear Nelly, you will be inundated with pictures :)



:laughing :laughing Good!! I will be waiting :thumbs:

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PostPosted: Wed Apr 02, 2014 10:26 pm 
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Sultry Swan
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rollyard wrote:
The normal eyed Lavender can be a little difficult to tell from silvers under certain light for example, but most times silver are quite clearly considerably lighter in plumage colour than the lavenders. Silvers aren't really lavender coloured (to me), rather more of a light silver-grey. What can be used to distinguish clearly between the two, even under poor light or photographs is that lavender have dark skin, particularly visible on the neck/head, whereas silver do not.

excellent point rollyard.

i describe the silver colour as: a super faded lavender & like it(lavender) has been hung in the sun for a couple of weeks in summer.

i too look forward to your hatch and the photos.
how long have they been on for & how is the fertility looking pazzwegian?
bits curious about wee guineas here. :-)

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PostPosted: Thu Apr 03, 2014 6:09 am 
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Showy Hen
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It's all been a bit of a saga actually! They were delivered over the long weekend while I was away, so were stuck at the post office for 5 days unturned. Two were broken, so 10 got set in the Rcom without much hope. To my great amazement, 9 have continued to grow, though I haven't candled for a couple of days now. They are due on Tuesday, which for me usually means they will hatch over the weekend. If I get even a couple, I will be very excited, have been wanting cinnamons and silvers for a long time :)


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PostPosted: Thu Apr 03, 2014 8:12 am 
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Sultry Swan
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great so far from posted eggs Pazzwegian!
hope they go the distance for you.

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Last edited by grabby on Thu Apr 03, 2014 8:13 am, edited 1 time in total.
missed my P


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PostPosted: Thu Apr 03, 2014 3:39 pm 
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Golden Swan
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Fingers crossed for you. It is sounding hopeful! :thumbs:

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PostPosted: Sun Apr 06, 2014 9:03 pm 
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Sultry Swan
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any pipping yet?

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PostPosted: Mon Apr 07, 2014 11:51 am 
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Showy Hen
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Three, have hatched, 1 more is pipped and rocking around. 1 got a bit caught up in the divider (hatched earlier than I thought) and seems to have a splayed leg. Have done the bandaid splint and I am hoping for the best!
In terms of colour, I'm not sure what's happening. The three that have hatched are heavily pied and don't look much different to a pearl pied. They are not lavender, more a brownish colour. Can't really see what colour their eyes are as they are still in the incubator, but they look dark to me :(
Anyway, hope I do actually get a cinnamon or silver out of the remaining eggs, and I will definitely keep you all posted and post photos when I move them to the brooder..
Wish me luck!


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PostPosted: Mon Apr 07, 2014 8:43 pm 
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Wise Wyandotte
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If they are lavender x cinnamon then they could end up normal pearl colour. It won't be till the next generation that you get some homozygous recessives ie. lavender, cinnamons and maybe silvers turn up.


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PostPosted: Mon Apr 07, 2014 9:29 pm 
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Sultry Swan
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LUCK!

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PostPosted: Tue Apr 08, 2014 9:13 am 
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Sultry Swan
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andrewschooks wrote:
If they are lavender x cinnamon then they could end up normal pearl colour.
is that because lavenders came from pearl to start with?

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