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PostPosted: Tue Oct 13, 2015 10:26 am 
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Old Mother Goose
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Before you take offence at this please read on.
Many of us started out with a few ISA's (or commercial layers). Some have chosen to continue with the Pure Breeds.

I have a regular stall at our local community markets.
I sell chook poop, worm wee and some seasonal produce and preserves.
This month I have fertile eggs on offer from a range of my purebreed poultry - I am over people asking if I have ISA brown's available :aaargh:
In a moment of weakness I offered to do a live display of some of the breeds on offer, so I am currently planning/preparing some information to introduce people to some chookie options.

I will refer them to BYP as a resource.

Are there any restrictions/copyright issues if I have available some copies of the BYP 'breeds list'

As you all know "I only have 6" ;-)

Pics to follow if all goes well.


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 13, 2015 12:07 pm 
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Proud Rooster
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Yes it seems everyone is mesmerized by the lovely rusty looking, therefore must be more healthy for us, red chooks.
I would alert people to the health issues that commercial layers have after a season or 2 of laying, therefore the requirement for early demise.
Whereas the heritage breeds don't seem to have those issues.

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going through the process of getting organic certification for my property but horse & chook worming throwing a big spanner in the works

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PostPosted: Tue Oct 13, 2015 1:54 pm 
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Old Mother Goose
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Agreed -ONE of my reasons for advising against ISA's and recomending pure breeds (or even pretty X breeds) is that they have been engineered to lose their fear of humans (which people interpret as friendly) and are bred as a 'throw away item'. So they become family pets and every one is devastated when their health fails after a couple of years.


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 13, 2015 7:28 pm 
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Assist Admin
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I think that as long as you credit BYP for the information in the breeds list I don't see an issue. Ultimately it is up to Cathy though.
Sing out if need anything else to help you do this. It sounds like a great idea :thumbs:

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PostPosted: Tue Oct 13, 2015 7:48 pm 
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Proud Rooster
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Sometimes they are called Gingerhams, not Isa. Personally I would prefer fewer eggs & healthier, longer lived chooks.

Good on you for trying to educate people about their wide ranging options.


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 14, 2015 10:27 am 
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Showy Hen
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Bungie wrote:
Sometimes they are called Gingerhams, not Isa. Personally I would prefer fewer eggs & healthier, longer lived chooks.


Most that are called ISAs probably aren't ISA browns. ISA is an acronym for a company that developed a commercial laying hybrid. There are a bunch of other companies that have developed their own, like Barter Browns, Lohmann Brown, Gingerhams. In the US there are probably dozens of different strains.


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 14, 2015 11:28 am 
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Proud Rooster
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It's like the white hen I have. Her breed was developed by Bond Farms(or Hatcheries) near Toowoomba.
She is a precocious slightly larger bird that produces huge eggs probably for the bulk wet egg market rather than retail trade.
But as to the name of her breed, well it could be anything!

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going through the process of getting organic certification for my property but horse & chook worming throwing a big spanner in the works

Favourite saying: Madness is doing the same thing over & over, but expecting a different result! -Einstein


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 14, 2015 1:16 pm 
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Old Mother Goose
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Just call them "Commercial Browns", there are a few I can name that are all basically the same just owned/produced/marketted by different companies, such as ISA Brown, Gingerham, HyLine, Barter Brown, Bond Brown, and I am sure there is a few others.

ISA is for the French company Institute de Society Agriculture (Well something like that anyway.)


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 14, 2015 3:45 pm 
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Old Mother Goose
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The difference between brands like ISA and some of the other commercials listed is that some are basically cross breeds (with the resulting hybrid vigour) while some of the brands are bred to a 'secret recipe' - with 'who knows what?' modifications. They were not developed for the backyard market but for large scale commercial operations where profit is the driver.


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PostPosted: Fri Oct 16, 2015 8:34 pm 
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Golden Phoenix
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Feel free to use these info sheets that the Canberra Backyard Poultry Club developed for handing out at various stalls. I've got them linked at http://havoc.typepad.com/bentshed/poult ... heets.html. The "4 breeds for you" uses images from the BYP forums, with permission.

I believe the copyright on the images in the BYP galleries is still vested in the owner of the pictures - the one who uploaded them - not BYP. But you can check with Cathy.


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PostPosted: Fri Oct 16, 2015 9:18 pm 
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Old Mother Goose
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Thanks infoaddict - love the site


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PostPosted: Sat Oct 17, 2015 9:32 pm 
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Golden Phoenix
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Thanks :)


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PostPosted: Sun Oct 18, 2015 10:42 am 
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Dapper Duck
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"Commercial Browns" is a good name for them. I just call them "Browns" when I'm talking to someone else who knows chooks.

My husband bought me 8 Browns about 3 years ago, one of his more thoughtful Christmas presents, and I have found that they are not a "line" (think cattle that all look the same). Health issues started early (eggs with the white trailing out, lumpy yolk with no shell and very little white, etc, uneven temperament). As it happened, I had other bitzers in my flock (a mixed brood also given to me) and one of these, plus the rooster, had araucana. I fell in love with Araucanas and was going to make them my flock but then I found out that they moult quite severely and go off the lay for at least two months.

I (well my little bantam hen did) successfully hatched 3/6 pure Ara's from eggs dispatched through the mail, and these two have been superior egg layers compared to the Browns. They do not lay every day but 4 - 5 eggs per week is OK by me, the shells are nice and strong. Then I found out the rooster is an Ara/Australorp cross, and when I needed fertile eggs, a lady was able to offer me Australorp eggs and I grabbed them. The chicks have, in the main, a lovely temperament (will be POL at New Year). Pancho's crosses with the Ara's have also a reasonable temperament and the eggs, 4 - 5 a week, are sound.

I am now in the position of having to cull the Browns, recycling as B & B under the rose bushes and in the vegetable patch), they stopped laying on the dot after two years. Knowing what I know now, I would have been better to dispatch them on the two year mark, as family would love them as "slow cook chooks".

So yes, after all that rambling above, I am entirely in agreement that folk looking for chickens as pets as well as layers, would be better off with the pure-breds or even crosses of the pure breds, rather than the throw-away Browns.

You would be doing your market clients a favour, I reckon.


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PostPosted: Sun Oct 18, 2015 10:20 pm 
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Prime Pekin
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ISA stands for Institut de Sélection Animale, the company which developed the hybrid in 1978 for egg production as a battery hen. (SOURCE: Wikepedia)

I for one am curious that at a recent poultry auction ISA Brown fertile eggs were being auctioned.

I thought that as these were a commercial layer the breed was not "privately" available through private breeders? :hmmm: :huh?


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PostPosted: Mon Oct 19, 2015 7:11 am 
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Yes, use what you need from here in terms of breeds list. The images on the breeds list are all ok to reproduce on that list. I consulted with the owners and a lot of them are mine or Andy's and we don't mind.

Pictures in the gallery are owned by those that uploaded them.

On the hybrids, I've been told that many of the browns around these days are not Isas any more, but Lohman Browns more often. Megg Miller is very quick to nicely pick me up if the term Isa slips out at times. It seems there are very few Isas if any now being sold into backyards as layers.

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