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PostPosted: Sun Jul 01, 2012 10:48 am 
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Dapper Duck
Dapper Duck

Joined: Thu Jan 22, 2009 1:42 pm
Posts: 31
Hi there- I appreciate your help. Susanne

Age: 2 years
Breed: Rhode Island
Sex: Female

Your Location- country, state (different areas/climates have different problems)
ANSWER: Bellarine Peninsula Victoria

What is wrong? What symptoms have you noted? - As much detail as possible please.
ANSWER:
She is sneezing and has laboured breathing through her mouth (not her nose). It is not too bad at the moment, but about 4 weeks ago we had to kill another chicken that had the same symptoms but which had gotten so terrible that we thought it best to put her out of her misery. I am wanting to see if I can avoid having to do this again.

Apart from that, there are no other symptoms, there is no nasal discharge, she has energy (she is doing laps of her pen that she is isolated in because she wants to be back with the others. And she is eating. She looks to be quite healthy. .

I have isolated her. (she is part of a flock of 18)

Full droppings description.- colour, consistency, frequency, offensive smell.
ANSWER: her poo is green and perhaps a little runny- but it still has a firm-ish consistency, but they free range and get lots of grass etc

Respiratory Changes?- eg. breathing sounds, discharge, laboured breathing, facial swelling
ANSWER:
breathing with her beak open, through her mouth (? beak) not her nose. Not doing this all the time, but when she does, it looks as if she is trying suck in air. But there is no discharge from her eyes or nose. This was the same as the last chicken, but when when we first discovered it on her breathing was really really laboured and we didn't think she'd live through the night, but she did, the symptoms calmed down for about 3-4 weeks and then got really bad and that is when we killed her. So in this case I think we have spotted the symptoms early and hence they are only mild. Everything else appears normal.

Digestive Changes?- eg. eating, drinking, crop filling & emptying
ANSWER:
all appear normal

Condition Changes?- eg. Weight, comb/wattle colour, skin, feathering
ANSWER:
seem to be normal

Behavioural Changes?- inc. socialising, laying, crowing, broodiness
ANSWER:
she was socialising as normal, but I have isolated her.

Agility Changes? - eg. any lameness, favouring, energy levels
ANSWER:
no
Describe your usual worming routine and products. [If none, say so and skip the next 3 worming questions.] Do you have a cycle that you use eg. every 3 months, or every six months?
ANSWER:
After the last chicken was sick and someone had suggested gape worm, I bought Avitrol Plus and have wormed the whole flock with that. Prior to this I was using Piperzol every 6-8 weeks

1. When was the bird last wormed??- approximate date.
ANSWER:
1 week ago
2. What product was used to worm the bird, and how was it given? ? eg. in the drinking water, on the skin, by injection?
ANSWER: Avitrol

3. Was a follow up dose given? (eg. 10-14 days later)
ANSWER: this was the follow up dose... so wormed 4 weeks ago and then one week ago

Any other recent medications?- antibiotics, coccidiosis meds, herbal remedies, etc
ANSWER: no

Other changes? – additions to the flock, diet, housing, extreme weather
ANSWER:
no additions, just a sad subtraction as mentioned above. It has been very wet and a bit chilly.

Photos? – any relevant photos are very helpful
INSERT HERE: no photos


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PostPosted: Sun Jul 01, 2012 11:08 am 
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Golden Magpie
Golden Magpie
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Joined: Tue Jun 05, 2007 5:26 pm
Posts: 16656
Location: Gulgong, NSW
Hi

Can you have a look in the chooks mouth and throat and see if there is any whitis/ yellowish plaques or lumps there - at the same time smell the chooks breath and tell me what sort of smell it has.

What you have described doesn't sound like the more common viral cold/flu thing

Mike

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PostPosted: Sun Jul 01, 2012 3:05 pm 
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Dapper Duck
Dapper Duck

Joined: Thu Jan 22, 2009 1:42 pm
Posts: 31
Hi,
so just went and checked as you suggested, her mouth and throat are clear. But then after checking her and we had put her down noticed liquid like water, slightly thicker coming from her bottom, and she looked as if she was trying to poo. When I picked her up to examine that, it looks like a 'prolapsed cloaca'? There is a dark red something that goes in and out as she contracts...

I don't think she has laid an egg for some time... 18 chooks and 0 - 3 eggs a day.

:( ...
Not sure if these two things are related. Could it be that in just picking her up I caused something. I hadn't noticed any difference in the way she was standing or that she had been contracting her bum at all before this. As i said she had been active in her isolation pen, walking around.

chooks.. who said they were easy!!
susanne


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PostPosted: Sun Jul 01, 2012 3:13 pm 
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Golden Magpie
Golden Magpie
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Joined: Tue Jun 05, 2007 5:26 pm
Posts: 16656
Location: Gulgong, NSW
Oh !!

Not good - check her in an hour and let me know if thats still happening. In the meantime do a search and read up on egg yolk peritonitis. Use the search function on here and "egg yolk peritonitis" as keywords. Dont fixate on it but be aware of what I am looking for and needing to eliminate.

Mike

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PostPosted: Sun Jul 01, 2012 5:22 pm 
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Dapper Duck
Dapper Duck

Joined: Thu Jan 22, 2009 1:42 pm
Posts: 31
Hi Mike,
I have just checked her, I arrived just as she was doing what looked to me a healthy poo (green with white and good consistency). But she is still contracting her bum, though not as much as before. She has a white line of dribble.
I looked up the EYP and I am not an expert, but it doesn't look like it is that. she doesn't appear to have those symptoms.

She also had a small drink whilst I was there.

Reading up on prolapse cloaca I am wondering if I should start some of those treatments, I have some haemaroid cream i could use.
thanks
Susanne


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PostPosted: Sun Jul 01, 2012 5:34 pm 
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Golden Magpie
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Posts: 16656
Location: Gulgong, NSW
The cream is a good start. It will reduce the swelling but it may not fix the root problem. Sometimes it just goes away being just one of those things, sometimes they need a forced moult and weeks in a dark enviroment to fully recover, sometimes it needs sutures and finally, sometimes it cant be fixed.

Lets run with the easy stuff first. But the dribble continues to concern me - its not normal !! Although the alimentary tract and the oviduct share the cloaca, they are two quite separate tracts and discharge is not normal from either.

Mike

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Retired Now - Have moved and can be found sitting on a boat with a bit of string in the water with a fish enticing safety pin at the end of it. Officially a Tuross Head resident.


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PostPosted: Mon Jul 02, 2012 10:06 am 
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Dapper Duck
Dapper Duck

Joined: Thu Jan 22, 2009 1:42 pm
Posts: 31
Hi Mike and anyone else reading.
Thanks for your adivce. Unfortunately she died this morning... It was too late last night to do the cream, so got up early before work. The prolapse was much worse this morning, we brought her inside to clean and put cream on. I tried pushing it back in but it would just come straight back out again. She struggled a bit (who wouldn't) and by the time i had finished she had gone all floppy, and we decided we should end it for her, but by the time we got outside she was dead. Maybe the stress of it gave her a heart attack. :(
Poor love.

So. Clearly she had a prolapse, and maybe it had been like that for a while, my partenr said she had noticed some clear runny stuff coming from her bum the day before we had isolated her for what we thought was a cold/flu (the funny breathing we mentioned in the first post). But I had also read that a prolapse can cause respiratory issues, so that cuold explain the breathing through her mouth. Although she was sneezing a bit too.
We were talking about it this morning, we had a Rhode Island that we would often find in the roosting box at night- not on the perches with the rest- not broody though becuase she would be out the rest of the day. i would just take her out and put her on the perch. Maybe this was the same chicken, finding a more comfy and warmer spot to sleep.

Thanks again- you are all so great with your advice and time. I hope we don't see another prolapse for a while.... ever.
Susanne


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PostPosted: Mon Jul 02, 2012 10:45 am 
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Golden Magpie
Golden Magpie
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Joined: Tue Jun 05, 2007 5:26 pm
Posts: 16656
Location: Gulgong, NSW
Its sounding very much like she had egg yolk peritonitis. That is where an egg has broken inside of her and a massive infection has taken hold. The resultant infection has produced pressure and pain hence the apparant prolapse and it would explain the gasping posture and the discharge.

It would also explain the fairly sudden death. Yes, in the end its heart failure due to the infection spreading. Sadly, even with very sophisticated medical care and high doses of appropriate antibiotics less than than 50% of birds survive egg yolk peritonitis.

You and your fowl were just unlucky

Mike

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Retired Now - Have moved and can be found sitting on a boat with a bit of string in the water with a fish enticing safety pin at the end of it. Officially a Tuross Head resident.


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PostPosted: Mon Jul 02, 2012 11:07 am 
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Fiesty Fowl
Fiesty Fowl

Joined: Mon Apr 16, 2012 7:52 pm
Posts: 1195
Location: Melbourne
Susanne sorry for your loss :grouphug:

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Having a break from chooks for a while...

You can read more on my blog here! www.domestica.com.au


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PostPosted: Mon Jul 02, 2012 12:29 pm 
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Dapper Duck
Dapper Duck

Joined: Thu Jan 22, 2009 1:42 pm
Posts: 31
Hmm, interesting EYP. They hide their distress so well, I imagine that would have been very uncomfortable.
Is there anything that can be done to prevent EYP-or is it as you say, just bad luck?

17 chooks left now - so probably 17 plus more things to learn about chooks! It is like a distance education course in avian vet practice, learning on the job!
Thanks again.
Susanne


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PostPosted: Mon Jul 02, 2012 1:35 pm 
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Golden Magpie
Golden Magpie
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Joined: Tue Jun 05, 2007 5:26 pm
Posts: 16656
Location: Gulgong, NSW
Yes it is just bad luck - an egg rupturing in the oviduct is due to a number of causes but its just one of those things.

Mike

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Retired Now - Have moved and can be found sitting on a boat with a bit of string in the water with a fish enticing safety pin at the end of it. Officially a Tuross Head resident.


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