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 Post subject: Frostbite
PostPosted: Tue Jan 08, 2013 7:27 am 
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Frostbite?

I have no experience of this, but as we have a few members from colder parts, they can probably relate to the topic.

I'm going to quote Kenny Troiano's comments on the topic and others are welcome to add to it.

Problems Due to Frostbite: Friends of min that live in states where the climate is colder tell me that frostbite is a real problem with their gamefowl, especially during the winter months. The combs and wattles on your un-dubbed stags are a particular problem when it comes to frostbite, which will redden in color and become swollen. If you suspect your fowl has been frostbitten, treat it as you would any case of frostbite, by rubbing he affected parts with cold water. Once they have thawed out the combs and wattles can be extremely painful so treat them gently.

Frostbitten birds may become lethargic and lack energy, and will eventually stop eating. This is another reason why trimming or dubbing may be a good idea. In fact, many people I know who live up north make it a practice of removing the combs and wattles from even the very young of chicks. This way they can avoid this problem during the most crucial time of their development. In areas where it gets extremely cold an insulated brood house or cock house with well=placed electric light bulbs is a good idea. This will help keep your fowl from being uncomfortably cold and becoming highly stressed.


p. 202 The Chronicles of Kenny Troiano

I have also heard that putting vaseline on the combs and wattles can help to prevent frostbite. Never had a need to try it here though.

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 Post subject: Re: Frostbite
PostPosted: Tue Jan 08, 2013 7:29 am 
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Golden Magpie
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Quote:
I've been told there's a technical difference between frostbite and frostburn.


lol yeah there is.

True frost bite is where limbs, fingers, ears, toes, feet and noses actually freeze solid. The sort of thing that Mawson in the antartic would have had to deal with. The body part is frozen and circulation ceases entirely. The cells freeze and rupture and ultimately the affected part dies and falls off or allows gangrenous infection. It was a problem in World War One with troop standing in frozen and near frozen water in the trenches over winter.

Frost burn is what we tend to see here (and what we tend to also call frost bite). Its where a rooster, for example, has his comb in very cold below zero weather and the body struggles to supply enough circulation to it to keep it from freezing. The points on the comb and some surface areas come almost frozen as a result. Some tissue is damaged but its repairable by the body. Its more aligned to a burn than true frost bite.

Obviously there is a cross over and frost burn, given the right conditions and continued exposure could turn into frost bite. Its much the same as heat exhaustion can turn into heat stroke.

Its symantics but there is a technical difference.

Here is a link with some frost bite photo on humans - not too gross or severe though. Interestingly they they dont draw a distinction between frost burn and frost bite in the way I was taught forty odd years ago.

http://firstaid.about.com/od/heatcoldex ... -Pictures/

Mike

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 Post subject: Re: Frostbite
PostPosted: Tue Jan 08, 2013 7:31 am 
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Sultry Swan
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This is a case of frost bite. The black bits are the parts that were frozen. It's dead tissue that eventually will fall off. It happened during a very cold winter in Germany (January 2009).
Image

Another example of frost bite at - 26 degrees C. The owner had put vaseline on the comb and the wattles. But they still got frost bite. He said that when he took the rooster inside his wattles were covered in ice because the got wet when the rooster was drinking. The member has put some ointment on the wattles:
Image
The same rooster a fortnight later: The comb looked worse than when it started. You can see that parts of the comb have fallen off:
Image

I reckon the following picture shows mostly frost burn. It happened during the same winter but this bird was more lucky. He belonged to a different owner who might have lived in a slightly warmer area or might have had a coop that was better insulated.
Image
This is how he looked a fortnight later:
Image


Pictures sourced from German chicken website: huehner-info.de

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 Post subject: Re: Frostbite
PostPosted: Tue Jan 08, 2013 7:32 am 
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I was a little bit suprised by some of those photos. I really did expect to see more severe examples of what it can do. Compared to photos of frost bitten people from Everest, Antartica etc it seems that chooks get away fairly lightly.

Not a criticism of the photos Redback, just suprised. I guess poultry have such a high rate of respiration, metabolism and circulation as compared to mammals.

Slightly off topic, my best mate for a few years now has been selling his Kelpies into Norway as sheep dogs. Apparently they fare better in the winter conditions than Border Collies. The kelpies have short coats of hair which doesnt freeze when it gets wet in snow etc. The collies have longer coats which does get quite wet and freezes giving the dogs hypothermia.

Different problems and solutions for different parts of the world.

Mike

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 Post subject: Re: Frostbite
PostPosted: Tue Jan 08, 2013 9:22 am 
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I'm feeling cooler already just reading this thread. And a good reminder that our weather conditions aren't the only ones in world. Thanks for sharing.

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 Post subject: Re: Frostbite
PostPosted: Tue Jan 08, 2013 1:37 pm 
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Sultry Swan
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chookyinoz wrote:
Slightly off topic, my best mate for a few years now has been selling his Kelpies into Norway as sheep dogs. Apparently they fare better in the winter conditions than Border Collies. The kelpies have short coats of hair which doesnt freeze when it gets wet in snow etc. The collies have longer coats which does get quite wet and freezes giving the dogs hypothermia.
Mike


When we were given our St Bernard, I did a little research on them and it turns out that despite popular depictions of big hairy St Bernards sasquashing around in snow... it was quite innacurate for the same reasons... there is also a short coat Bernard which were used as opposed to the long hair since their coats don't hold moisture and freeze!!

Having said that, it makes me wonder on a whole if loose feathered birds or tight feathered birds fare better in cold weather. I know the eskimo's wore a loose outer clothing so the warm air could circulate around beneath the skins they wore. Having said that I would assume a loose feathered bird would have the advantage in the cold!!

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