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 Post subject: Lump on Face
PostPosted: Mon Apr 29, 2013 1:35 am 
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Junior Champion Bird
Junior Champion Bird

Joined: Sat Aug 04, 2007 7:29 pm
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Location: North Coast NSW
anyone have an idea what this is,can i fix it, or should i just cull
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 Post subject: Re: Lump on Face
PostPosted: Mon Apr 29, 2013 1:44 am 
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Phoenix
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Respiratory infection got any antibiotics. You can see the sinus are swollen and bubbly eye.
Good pellets,vitamins .Can be cured.the weather is probably not helping much at present.

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 Post subject: Re: Lump on Face
PostPosted: Mon Apr 29, 2013 7:26 am 
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Site Administrator
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Location: Morayfield, SEQ
Yep, it's a build-up of the by-products of infection in the sinus. I hate to see this and if I do I weigh up the value of the fowl. Most of the time this can be difficult to treat because it is a build-up of that thick yellow pus that isn't easy to move. There is little blood flow to the area and consequently antibiotics have limited access. This is a case where sinus flushing would help in conjunction with prescription antibiotics.

In some cases (although not often) it can just be swelling or looser material but if it doesn't go down in a couple of days I would assume it's the thick nuisance kind. You could put a needle in it and see if you can draw anything out of it or not. If not, I'd say it's the thick pus that's going to be a pain.

I would quarantine this bird from the rest of the flock while you are treating it, at the very least. If it's not a valuable bird or one that I wanted to keep, I'd be thinking about the rest of the flock. We tend to get quite ruthless when it comes to respiratory infections like that.

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 Post subject: Re: Lump on Face
PostPosted: Mon Apr 29, 2013 10:49 am 
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Junior Champion Bird
Junior Champion Bird

Joined: Sat Aug 04, 2007 7:29 pm
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Location: North Coast NSW
So which antibiotic? I use oxymav 100 but this hasn't achieved much on this fowl in regards to the lump. The fowl looks well,eats fine, isn't lethargic at all. How do i do a sinus flush and is it possible to surgically remove the lump. Its fairly hard and has been there for sometime. I'm happy to try the needle but theres very little movement at the core of the lump.


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 Post subject: Re: Lump on Face
PostPosted: Mon Apr 29, 2013 11:01 am 
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Wise Wyandotte
Wise Wyandotte

Joined: Fri Feb 15, 2008 11:58 am
Posts: 4234
Location: Plainland, SEQ
I agree with Cathy.
If this bird is valuable to you and you decide to keep it you could try to do what we are doing at the moment. I'm currently treating a Marans hen and rooster for a similar problem. Additionally, our birds both had a very bad conjunctivitis on one eye. If I lose one of them this will be the end of the Marans here.
We started the hen's treatment a week ago and she looks alright now but yet I'm not sure if she's recovered fully. She's finished her medication and is well. She has yet to be put back with the other birds, though. The rooster's treatment has only started yesterday. He's looking much better today but I don't know whether he'll recover or not.
The main things we did were the following treatment twice a day:
- Cleaning up every visible signs of external muck and mucus.
- Checking inside the the mouth and the throat. They both had large amounts of pus that were visible immediately when we had a look inside. We cleaned it out with cotton tips and forceps. By the time the next treatment was due some more pus was visible that had to be cleaned out. It was most important to get to the gunk that had accumulated in the gap in the upper mandible (sorry, I don't know the correct name for it). If you look inside the mouth of the bird, you'll see this gap in the middle of the upper mandible which is the connection from the mouth to the nostrils and eyes. We found that, if there is a build up of pus in the sinus, there will be an even worse build up of pus in there. Once that is cleaned out the pus from the nostrils has a chance to get out through this gap again. Flushing of the sinus with saline was helpful after most of the gunk in that gap had gone.
- We gave painkillers/antinflammatories (Meloxicam or Carprofen) to help the bird with the pain that the cleaning of the gunk involved and to help with the inflammation. We also gave oral antibiotics (Clavulox for the hen, Baytril or the rooster as we didn't have enough of the Clavulox to treat both).
- The eyes got cleaned twice a day, as well. We also applied antibiotic cortisol eye cream (Amacin)
- The rooster also had very bad scabs from fowl pox with pus underneath. We've softened the scabs with saline, applied Betadine and put some antiseptic cream on the wounds to assist healing.
- To aid the recovery we gave additional bird vitamins (Abdextra) in the water plus a good diet (Laucke Showbird MP)

edited to add:
Oxymav will be pretty useless in this case (as you already found out). You'll need a prescription antibiotic, preferably Amoxicillin with Clavulanic acid. Personally, I don't like doing surgery on an infected area. It will create another area that will have to heal and can get even worse. I didn't expect to get that good results with getting the pus out through the roof of the upper mandible, to be honest. If you can access the pus this way as well it will be much safer than opening that abscess from the outside. Once the pus was cleaned out from the inside I was even able to gently massage that pus out of the sinus down into that gap where I could grab it fairly easily with the forceps.

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 Post subject: Re: Lump on Face
PostPosted: Mon Apr 29, 2013 10:10 pm 
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Junior Champion Bird
Junior Champion Bird

Joined: Sat Aug 04, 2007 7:29 pm
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Location: North Coast NSW
thanks for the advice,i'll give it a go. I have tablets containing 875mg of amoxycillin and 125mg of clavulanic acid. Any ideas of dosage rates?


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 Post subject: Re: Lump on Face
PostPosted: Tue Apr 30, 2013 12:09 am 
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Wise Wyandotte
Wise Wyandotte

Joined: Fri Feb 15, 2008 11:58 am
Posts: 4234
Location: Plainland, SEQ
200 mg Amoxicillin and 50 mg Clavulanic acid per 2 kg bird per day, half of this in the morning, the other half at night.
With your tablets I'd give roughly a quarter of a tablet per 2 kg bird per day, again split into two doses a day.

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 Post subject: Re: Lump on Face
PostPosted: Tue Apr 30, 2013 10:44 am 
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Old Mother Goose
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Joined: Tue Oct 09, 2012 7:26 pm
Posts: 5274
Location: Dooralong NSW
How do you flush the sinuses ?

Are you just using a syringe in through the nostril ?

we have one of our pullets with a small lump in front of one eye, like Pearls but a lot smaller, she is very valuable, as she in entered in a show next month & is one of our best pullets.
It is soft and squishy to touch, about as big as this smilie :arrow: so about 6mm diametre.

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 Post subject: Re: Lump on Face
PostPosted: Tue Apr 30, 2013 11:01 am 
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Phoenix
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Instructions for treating foaming or bubbling eye and infected sinuses:

from Peter Brown of First State Vet Supply:

I have seen this many times before. The underlying causes are many. Things such as E.coli, Pseudomonas,Coryza, Bronchitis,etc.

I would Nasal Flush the bird using Oxine or Tylan 50 with sterile water. I would then apply either eye drops or eye ointment to the eye several times daily.

DIRECTIONS FOR TREATING SINUSITIS WITH SWOLLEN EYES

NASAL FLUSH USING TYLAN 50 OR LA-200

USING 12 CC’S OF STERILE WATER ADD 2 CC OF TYLAN 50 OR 1 CC OF LA-200 AND THEN FLUSH EACH NOSTRIL( USING A SYRINGE WITH THE NEEDLE REMOVED ) WITH 3 TO 4 CC’S TWICE PER DAY FOR 5 TO 7 DAYS. THE BIRDS HEAD SHOULD BE HELD DOWN SO AS NOT TO SWALLOW TO MUCH OF THE TYLAN SOLUTION.

FOLLOW THE FLUSHING WITH VET-RX SQUIRTED LIBERALLY INTO EACH NOSTRIL. DO THIS AFTER EACH FLUSHING.

USING THE EYE OINTMENTS IS A CRITICAL PART OF GETTING THE SWELLING TO GO DOWN. USE THE EYE OINTMENT EVERY 2 TO 3 HOURS DURING THE DAY IF AT ALL POSSIBLE. YOU SHOULD USE IT AT LEAST TWICE PER DAY. START IN ONE CORNER OF THE EYE AND LAY DOWN A SMALL STRIP OF THE EYE OINTMENT FROM ONE CORNER OF THE EYE TO THE OTHER CORNER OF THE EYE.

IT MAY ALSO BE HELPFUL TO FLUSH THE EYE ONCE PER DAY WITH AN OVER THE COUNTER HUMAN EYE WASH THAT IS BORIC ACID BASED AND THEN PROCEED WITH THE NASAL FLUSHING AS DESCRIBED ABOVE. THE EYE WASHES ARE READILY AVAILABLE IN ALL DRUG STORES.

IT MAY BE NECESSARY TO USE MORE POWERFUL ANTIBIOTICS TO CURE THIS SWOLLEN EYE PROBLEM. IF YOU ARE NOT MAKING PROGRESS , PLEASE CALL ME SO THAT WE MAY DISCUSS YOUR SITUATION AND MAKE ANY NECESSARY CHANGES.


TYLAN 50 OR LA-200 - 2 TO 3 DROPS DIRECTLY INTO THE EYE TWICE A DAY FOLLOWED BY THE EYE OINTMENT TWICE PER DAY FOR 5 TO 7 DAYS

CILOXAN EYE DROPS GIVEN AT THE RATE OF 2 TO 3 DROPS IN THE AFFECTED EYE 2 TO 3 TIMES A DAY FOR 5 TO 7 DAYS


Ciprofloxacin Eye drops or Chloramphenicol Eye Ointment available in the online store on this site.

This should take care of the problem.

Keep us posted if you will.

Keep em Healthy,

Doc

Read more: http://happyhenhouse.proboards.com/inde ... z2RtrqBrzS

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 Post subject: Re: Lump on Face
PostPosted: Tue Apr 30, 2013 11:12 am 
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Wise Wyandotte
Wise Wyandotte

Joined: Fri Feb 15, 2008 11:58 am
Posts: 4234
Location: Plainland, SEQ
Lacy, I simply used an small insulin syringe directly at the nostril as I didn't have anything else available. It's not overly effective like that, though as you'll get the flushing solution everywhere and only a part of it will got through the nostril. It would be much better to get a drip tube from the chemist's as it is smaller and very flexible. Be very careful that you do not drown the chook when flushing the sinus.

Before attempting to flush have a look inside her beak and check if you can clean any pus out from the gap in the roof of the upper mandible. Then try to gently massage the pus from the lump down into that gap and clean again. If you have the feeling there is still some pus in the sinus you then might want to flush it carefully. So far, I was very successful in doing it step by step over a few days. I just don't know yet if they'll stay okay or if it will recur.

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 Post subject: Re: Lump on Face
PostPosted: Tue Apr 30, 2013 1:34 pm 
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Old Mother Goose
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Location: Dooralong NSW
Thanks to both of you,
I haven't had a look yet to see if there is any puss there, but as I said, the lump is very squishy & she has no signs of anything in her eye.

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 Post subject: Re: Lump on Face
PostPosted: Sun Jan 07, 2018 6:39 pm 
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Prime Pekin
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Posts: 3318
Location: Melbourne CBD fringe
Hi Nostress

just wondering how your birds fared in the end? I have one with a similiar condition ...


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