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PostPosted: Thu Mar 31, 2016 9:31 am 
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Fiesty Fowl
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hello,my 4 yr old leghorn hen has been limping for about a month maybe a bit longer,i took her to an avian vet who said she was exceptionally healthy in every way she could see,she gave me meloxicam oral suspension for pain relief but its made no difference at all.what could she have wrong where pain meds don't do anything? does this pain med take a few doses to work? would appreciate any advice on this.
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PostPosted: Thu Mar 31, 2016 9:40 am 
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Old Mother Goose
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Sounds like there is a physical cause for the injury which is causing the limp (break? dislocation?) Soft tissue injuries take ages to heal. Was she X Rayed, any local swelling/heat? Meloxicam should give immediate relief. If she is maintaining her condition she is unlikely to be in great pain. She may just need time and rest.


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PostPosted: Thu Mar 31, 2016 11:29 am 
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Fiesty Fowl
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hi sue55, the vet couldn't feel any break or dislocation,she went over that area thoroughly, I was hoping the vet would've done an xray but she didn't feel it was necessary at that time,i can see another trip to the vet coming soon but I would've thought pain killer would work no matter what the cause.i had one of my others put down a few weeks ago and she had a persistant limp too but she was extremely emanciated and lost a lot of feathers,but the limp she had as well but this bird has kept good condition.


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PostPosted: Thu Mar 31, 2016 11:46 am 
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Golden Robin
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The trouble is that meloxicam is not a pain killer. Its an anti-inflammatory agent. It may be working just fine but injury just takes time to heal.

Mike

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PostPosted: Thu Mar 31, 2016 3:58 pm 
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Showy Hen
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chookyinoz wrote:
The trouble is that meloxicam is not a pain killer. Its an anti-inflammatory agent. It may be working just fine but injury just takes time to heal.

Mike


Hi Mike, why do you say meloxicam is not a pain killer? Please refer to http://www.drugs.com/meloxicam.html .

Meloxicam falls under the group of drug called Non-steroidal anti-inflammatory drugs (NSAIDs). Neurofen (ibuprofen) belongs to the NSAIDs group and is used as pain killer in human (analgesia). Meloxicam is used in human for pain and anti-inflammatory purposes too by the way.

As far as I understand, meloxicam has analgesic properties.

the four key signs of inflammation are heat, pain, redness and swellings; anti-inflammatories such as meloxicam reduces these signs, so I guess its fair to say that meloxicam has pain killing properties.

I do agree that injury does take time to heal.

Correct me if I'm wrong.


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PostPosted: Thu Mar 31, 2016 4:12 pm 
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Maybe I am wrong ? I understood it to be an anti-inflammatory but it came on the market way after I finished studying.

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PostPosted: Thu Mar 31, 2016 8:58 pm 
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Fiesty Fowl
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now I don't know whether to keep giving it to her or not I think i'll stop it as I cant see any improvement. im worried an xray wont show anything but I will have it done anyway,i need to find what it is.along our back fence we have this massive vine with strong runners and they have entangled some of my chooks before I wouldn't be surprised if it were the culprit its very hard to cut it but im gonna try to fix that and weve got these tiny prickles in patches on our lawn and they hurt like hell and you cant see the prickles once theyre in your foot I thought that could've been it but the vet said she wouldn't be able to put any weight on it at all which she can.


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PostPosted: Thu Mar 31, 2016 9:32 pm 
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Old Mother Goose
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She was limping for a month before she went to the vet, so she's had this for a while & it may take a while to reverse itself.

How long since you took her to the vet & put her on the Meloxicam (which, although it reduces pain via it's NSAID properties & is prescribed for certain types of pain, is not technically a "pain-killer" in pharmaceutical terms)?

For a human, you'd commonly go on an NSAID in the first few days of inflammation & it should reduce significantly within 24 hours if you rest & elevate the strained area, usually applying ice regularly (which is a better anti-inflammatory for human muscle strains than anything you can take by mouth). Where it doesn't reduce in a human after that time, you'd often go back for another examination... at which point a GP may tell you that it is improving & will just take longer, and should tell you at what point to come back if there is still no improvement, or may send you for any of: X-rays, ultrasound, CT scan, MRI. That would depend on whether the GP thinks it's skeletal (X-ray) or soft tissue (more detail in the other scans for that) or nerve damage or compression (usually MRI). Even a "simple" muscle strain in a human can take 2 weeks after the event to fully heal, but you would generally expect the inflammation & worst of the pain to be gone within a few days.

Your chook has not been able to rest, or elevate the affected area, and has not had the above first aid applied (which may not all be applicable to a bird.... but even if the application of ice isn't suitable, the rest would help in most inflammation conditions... which includes a muscle strain... as that is a tear to the muscle, making it bleed, and causing inflammation within the torn area of the muscle).

In your position, I would phone the vet to clarify how long your chook should remain on the Moloxicam before you can stop giving it, and also how long before you should see no inflammation & feel no hot spot. If that time is up, ask the vet whether it's worth taking it in for a further examination and/or X-ray / scans or whether a watch & see approach is better for now. If it is, ask for another timeline before you should expect to see an improvement, or otherwise contact the vet. I would also (if you haven't already) have the chook in a smaller area than usual... a quarantine or sick pen, if you will, where its activity level will be reduced.


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PostPosted: Thu Mar 31, 2016 10:40 pm 
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Fiesty Fowl
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thanks winglet,yes I better ring the vet first,i shall also set up a crate tomorrow and put her in there,she cant really rest it while she's out and about so i'll try that.she's been on meloxicam for 3 days now.


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PostPosted: Fri Apr 01, 2016 6:38 pm 
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Old Mother Goose
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klw wrote:
thanks winglet,yes I better ring the vet first,i shall also set up a crate tomorrow and put her in there,she cant really rest it while she's out and about so i'll try that.she's been on meloxicam for 3 days now.


Sounds like a good plan.

I wish you luck & look forward to hearing what the vet recommends next.


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PostPosted: Tue Apr 05, 2016 12:01 am 
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Firstly, meloxicam IS an analgesic agent (pain killer). It is a cox-2 inhibitor... and the simplest way to explain what that means is that it blocks the sensitisation of nociceptors (nociceptors are the things that receive the 'this stimulus is painful' signals from the body) so that the pain messages never reach the brain. I'm not quite sure where people are getting the idea that NSAID's are not 'pain relief', because most of them are. They may act on a different area of the pain pathway than opioids do, but they are still classed as analgesics.

Secondly, klw, if your chook is still limping on the meloxicam, it means that either the limp isn't driven by pain (ie there's a functional issue) or presuming she is on the correct does, that an NSAID alone is not going to be enough to control the pain (either because it's chronic and she has too much 'windup' or because there is neuropathic pain, which NSAID's aren't effective for). Either way the answer is to do more diagnostics, usually starting with an xray. If your vet says it's not necessary, ask them what they would do if she were a dog or a cat... I bet they'd x-ray her, as that's what we generally do when a pain relief trial is not effective.

Also revisit their lifestyle and nutrition. You mentioned that a previous chook was also lame.... Are your chooks overweight? What bedding do they walk on? What perches? Are they getting enough calcium? etc etc etc. Unfortunately with most animals, prey species like poultry in particular, you can't be sure that they are 100% healthy just from a physical exam... so many things can be happening under the surface that we just can't tell with our naked eye. That's why we have to do xrays, CTs, MRIs, blood tests, ultrasounds and even exploratory surgeries (not for this particular case, I'm just making a general statement). Diagnostics exist for a reason, and if a pain relief trial didn't work then she needs further workup.


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PostPosted: Tue Apr 05, 2016 9:16 am 
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Old Mother Goose
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Great information. Thanks Baby Duck.


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PostPosted: Mon Oct 22, 2018 10:35 pm 
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Fiesty Fowl
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I know this is an old post but I still have the leghorn and the problem she had is arthritis in her toes the poor thing there’s not really anything I can do for her according to the vet.i haven’t got the heart to put her down she seems happy enough I wish there was something I could give her to help though


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PostPosted: Mon Oct 22, 2018 11:10 pm 
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oh klw it sounds like she has had a lovley caring life with you, and can go out in style in her own time as a grand dame

you have done all you can, and she has survived, so you have given her hte best possible opportunities and she is a very lucky hen

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