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PostPosted: Tue May 26, 2020 2:01 am 
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Junior Champion Bird
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Okaru wrote:
I think that's 5 projects Jose, not 3..... :peece :laughing


Hahahaaaaaaaaaaaaaa .yeah I know


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PostPosted: Fri May 29, 2020 7:42 pm 
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Junior Champion Bird
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more pullets are laying ,wish my marans are laying like them .
now the real work began .need to catch those pullets laying to see who is laying what ,before I breed them .


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PostPosted: Sun May 31, 2020 7:21 pm 
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Dapper Duck
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jose wrote:
I don t breed my pullets before 10 months old . they eggs has to reach 68/70g .


Some breeders recommend not breeding pullets until they have been through their first moult - why do you choose to breed at 10 months or 68/70 grams?


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PostPosted: Sun May 31, 2020 8:39 pm 
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Proud Rooster
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Philthomas I'd be interested in this answer too, but also why some breeders wait for a first moult?

I know young hens are less reliable in terms of hatching quality. But when does that change?


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PostPosted: Sun May 31, 2020 8:47 pm 
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Dapper Duck
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Okaru wrote:
Philthomas I'd be interested in this answer too, but also why some breeders wait for a first moult?

I know young hens are less reliable in terms of hatching quality. But when does that change?

https://www.thecuckoopoultrystudofaustr ... JdnaDMQ5K4


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PostPosted: Sun May 31, 2020 9:45 pm 
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Proud Rooster
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Interesting! So, say you knew the flock to be free of LL, what factors decide the best hen age for successful hatches?


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PostPosted: Mon Jun 01, 2020 3:00 am 
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Junior Champion Bird
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philthomas1 wrote:
jose wrote:
I don t breed my pullets before 10 months old . they eggs has to reach 68/70g .


Some breeders recommend not breeding pullets until they have been through their first moult - why do you choose to breed at 10 months or 68/70 grams?


that is correct .
for me I need to test mating them before I classify them as a breeders .I need to see what they capable of .it is fair to let they eggs get larger as the hens .
try to breed the 10 months old pullets to 2 or 3 different style cockerels to see what combination is a best if there is any . if I m not happy with a the result as mark her as a backyard layer .and I remove her from my selected flock . if I m happy with they progeny I will keep them and breed from them when they are adult .
I gain a lot time doing it this way . by the time a pullets finish molting and become a hen .I know exactly how I m going to breed her ,without loosing one more year test mating her .

if my marans pullets does not reach or passes 3Kg @ 10 months and her eggs does not reach 68g minimum than I will not classify her as a breeder .. late maturing type .

60% of the chicks I hatched last breeding season are fed to the dogs cockerels and pullets .only keeping 30/25% . still more selection has to be made ,especially the pullets . the cockerels are all selected just waiting for breeding time .
pullets I only selected based on conformation not laying ability .

I like to hatch my breeder in spring time if I can ,so I can breed from them next spring .year old .



there is a big difference in chicks vigor ,chicks from adult hen are solid and larger than chicks from pullets .


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PostPosted: Mon Jun 01, 2020 3:12 am 
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Junior Champion Bird
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Okaru wrote:
Interesting! So, say you knew the flock to be free of LL, what factors decide the best hen age for successful hatches?


for me to hatch my future breeders I need to use proven hens .they second laying cycle . that will give me enough time to test mate them ,asses they progeny and see to who they are compatible .

my last year breeders ,where all over 10 months old when I start breeding them ,now I have seen they progeny I know witch one I m keeping as my foundation breeder and witch one is going to be backyard layer .
40 pullets I used for breeding last year, only 7 of them are breeders . those 7 are now my foundation flock all tested and proven to reproduce .

I can t breed from hens because I like them .I never do that ,they have to prove them selves .


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PostPosted: Mon Jun 01, 2020 10:02 am 
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Proud Rooster
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Thank you!
Learning a lot... :)


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PostPosted: Mon Jun 01, 2020 10:48 am 
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Great Game
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The info on LL was an eye opener, had heard of wasting disease, seen it in Wild King Parrots, and heard of it in Red wing parrots also.
Definitely not going to breed from pullets now, why take the risk.


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PostPosted: Tue Jun 02, 2020 4:59 pm 
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Clever Cockerel
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jose wrote:
.... there is a big difference in chicks vigor ,chicks from adult hen are solid and larger than chicks from pullets .


Vorwerk people are finding this out in large numbers. Because there were so few around, every pullet egg from the imported stock was hatched. Now the breed is being blamed for being 'soft' and performing below expectations for chick and grower survival, and adult size and vigour. But more people are picking up on this and putting the blame where it belongs.

_________________
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 02, 2020 8:46 pm 
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Proud Rooster
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PossumCorner wrote:
jose wrote:
.... there is a big difference in chicks vigor ,chicks from adult hen are solid and larger than chicks from pullets .


Vorwerk people are finding this out in large numbers. Because there were so few around, every pullet egg from the imported stock was hatched. Now the breed is being blamed for being 'soft' and performing below expectations for chick and grower survival, and adult size and vigour. But more people are picking up on this and putting the blame where it belongs.


I guess those original pullets are now hens and presenting more robust chicks.
Is the impediment from the "weak generation" carried to the chicks of the next? Or is it possible to regain vigor in future generations once those weak chicks have developed into 2nd year hens? Meaning if the less vigorous chicks survive to a second season, do they breed more vigorous offspring?

Too hard for a tuesday night.... I think


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PostPosted: Wed Jun 03, 2020 4:10 am 
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Junior Champion Bird
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Okaru wrote:
PossumCorner wrote:
jose wrote:
.... there is a big difference in chicks vigor ,chicks from adult hen are solid and larger than chicks from pullets .


Vorwerk people are finding this out in large numbers. Because there were so few around, every pullet egg from the imported stock was hatched. Now the breed is being blamed for being 'soft' and performing below expectations for chick and grower survival, and adult size and vigour. But more people are picking up on this and putting the blame where it belongs.


I guess those original pullets are now hens and presenting more robust chicks.
Is the impediment from the "weak generation" carried to the chicks of the next? Or is it possible to regain vigor in future generations once those weak chicks have developed into 2nd year hens? Meaning if the less vigorous chicks survive to a second season, do they breed more vigorous offspring?

Too hard for a tuesday night.... I think


it is possible to restore vigor in the future generation but is not going to be easy . because pullets hatched from pullets mother { small eggs} they will never develop to big hens .
like you said those pullets are now older in they second year ,so they eggs will larger .
here the method to use to restore vigor and other great traits .
1} out cross the line s , mating 2 or 3 lines together to boost the natural hybrid vigor . never inbreed smaller birds .
2} need to separate pullets and cockerels at 4/5 months old .need to leave pullets grow nicely ,only penned with roosters when breeding time arrives . so both pullets and cockerels will reach they maximum growth .
3} select only the largest most robust looking birds to breed from .
4} select only the largest and correct shape eggs to incubate .
5} hatch a lot and cull hard as you go .

to increase body mass and size in any chooks line . need to breed only from the heaviest and largest hen/hens .


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PostPosted: Sat Jun 06, 2020 10:10 am 
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Junior Champion Bird
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Marans X CLB F1 cockerel .golden crele .he will have a big squirrel tail .different than his brothers /half brothers


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PostPosted: Sat Jun 06, 2020 9:01 pm 
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Proud Rooster
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jose wrote:

it is possible to restore vigor in the future generation but is not going to be easy . because pullets hatched from pullets mother { small eggs} they will never develop to big hens .
like you said those pullets are now older in they second year ,so they eggs will larger .
here the method to use to restore vigor and other great traits .
1} out cross the line s , mating 2 or 3 lines together to boost the natural hybrid vigor . never inbreed smaller birds .
2} need to separate pullets and cockerels at 4/5 months old .need to leave pullets grow nicely ,only penned with roosters when breeding time arrives . so both pullets and cockerels will reach they maximum growth .
3} select only the largest most robust looking birds to breed from .
4} select only the largest and correct shape eggs to incubate .
5} hatch a lot and cull hard as you go .

to increase body mass and size in any chooks line . need to breed only from the heaviest and largest hen/hens .



I appreciate the feedback, thanks.
I guess, genetically, the traits can be passed on as long as the parent carries it, (even if not expressed). However, you don't know what you have with a bird that is weak or has had growth suppressed., (because you cannot see it). So trying to breed from them is a lottery?
Also, if the parents are not strong, egg-chick quality will also be compromised

The last boy looks interesting. :shock:


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